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Floody
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PostSubject: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptyFri Jul 06, 2012 11:31 am

First topic message reminder :

Went sailing on the 4th and intended on sailing for a week but things dd not work out so well. Ill spare you the details and just head towards the issue...

...While sailing I went into the cabin and noticed water seeping in on the floor. I got on my belly and laid there for a bit. I noted that there was substantial flexing on the keel housing (forward where the keel hangs on the bolt) when my wife sailed over waves. I also noted that the keel was making a boom sound as we went over these waves. I raised and lowered the keel at times to try to relieve the boom sounds. But no luck!

This flexing and bulging was happening right at where the deck meets the keel housing in the curved area. The flex was bad and I could see the repair made by the PO was failing. Long story short the repair is not holding up and I want to know if this is a issue with Clippers? Can this be fixed correctly and if so how can I do it. Should I grind out the repair and see how bad it is? What do you all recommend. Also do swing keels naturally bang around inside the keel housing in moderate conditions?

Pictures will be posted as soon as I can retrieve my camera from the boat.
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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptySun Jul 29, 2012 8:17 pm

One more note. If you need to replace you should be able to cut way the fiberglass in one piece. Think of skinning an animal. Incise the perimeter and pull off the "skin". Replace the wood and bond the "skin" to the new wood. Then glass the edges where you made the incisions.

Heck you may want to do this even if the wood is just wet as it will speed drying time and you will know for sure it is completely dry as it will be entirely exposed for inspection.

Had a dingy w/ a saturated stern board that I started to do this to. In the end I decided to leave the skin off and just encapsulated the marine plywood in epoxy and paint it. I did cut out the HIN, recessed its location on the new board so it was flush, and bonded w/ West System Thickened Adhesive Epoxy. It turned out great and certainly so would have a complete re-skinning had I done it.

All the best, Ev.

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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptySun Jul 29, 2012 9:22 pm

Thanks for the advice. So you are saying I can reuse my old skin of glass? I am not sure it will peel back without taking some wood with it, but ill give it a shot.

I am sore as its been a busy day sanding. most of these pictures show all the sanding dust so pardon the construction.

I started by drilling a hole in the V-birth floor to see the extent of the water damage and the illusive false bilge. The hole revealed a lot of water, so I sucked it up with my shop vac.

Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 IMG_5044-300x300

Here is a shot of the damaged deck removed. Looking aft from the V-birth you can see the keel trunk.
Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 IMG_5045-300x300

In this shot you get a close up of the false bilge that runs parallel with the keel trunk. looking forward from aft.
Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 IMG_5041-300x300

Yup, thats water in the bilge. It looks white cause of all the sanding dust.
Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 IMG_5030-300x300

Rudder repairs. Some type of wood glue / resin a guy told me to use.
Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 IMG_5040-300x300

Sanded the tiller too
Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 IMG_5033-300x300

Stained the tiller and going to put west marine 106 over the entire tiller and rudder.
Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 IMG_5035-300x300

More to come but I need to let her dry out for a while. She will also be getting a new coat of paint.



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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptySun Jul 29, 2012 11:24 pm

Those are the best shots of a Clipper Marine tiller handle on the Internet!



My CM32 sloop needed a tiller, and to save my life, I could not find a photo of what it should look like.



As a temp fix, I used a wheelbarrow handle.



Your repairs are looking good!



Congrats on posts that have you over the 100 mark!

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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptyMon Jul 30, 2012 1:53 am

Barefoot in the glass?! Shocked

Looks like you are coming along nicely. If the skin is not delaminated to where it will peel right off then the damage likely isn't that bad and I would leave it on. Guess I was thinking worse case Ontario.

Shit Gary if you needed a tiller pic you should have asked me, or maybe you did and I missed it. Rolling Eyes
Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 Tiller


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Last edited by Everett CM32 on Mon Jul 30, 2012 2:03 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptyMon Jul 30, 2012 2:00 am

Feeling a bit of deja vu as I posted that tiller pic. Yep, I did that already.....
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Sorry for the hijack Floody.

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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptyMon Jul 30, 2012 9:08 am

Thanks Gary.

No worries Everett. That companion way looks killer as does your tiller. Kind of cool how your tiller differs from mine.

So talk about addicted. Last night I laid in the glue and glass so this morning I had to run and check on things before going to my office. Things look good for tonight's sanding session.

Also you noticed the barefoot print! Ha, yea I was all over that boat and took 4 showers yesterday. I found cold water removes the itch better.

More to come. . .
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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptyFri Aug 10, 2012 1:22 pm

Okay need a little advice here.

I have just about finished grinding out the damaged deck. The total slit is now about 7 inches wide as I can clearly see the false bilge. Anyways I wanted to know if I put in a new piece of wood (cause I ground out the old shit) then cover it with glass or just skip the wood and add more glass.

If I put in a new piece of wood, do I butt the ends together (old deck and new deck) or bevel them?

Otherwise I can post pictures soon. I have done a lot of work in a short time. I am replacing the counter tops, settee tops, deck and going to paint the entire thing. I hope I can finish in 4 weeks.
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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptySat Aug 25, 2012 5:50 pm

Still working on this damaged area. Almost ready for paint. Laughing

I itch like a tired dog with fleas but the old girl is coming together slow and easy. I have been teaching myself how to glass. Its really not that difficult.

First I cut a slab of 1/2" thick of pressure treated plywood and grinded a bevel all around the thing. It was roughly 4"wide x 48" long

Now I have added about 6 layers of fiberglass cloth, starting small then working out to very large pieces. Using west systems resin and hardener its beginning to look like a factory deck.

fingers crossed and ill be back on the water again next weekend.

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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptySun Aug 26, 2012 4:19 am

Sounds like you are getting her back together nicely. Cool

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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptyTue Aug 28, 2012 8:46 am

Okay here is a shot of the repair, its almost finished

Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 Augusto-004-400x300

AS you can see it was a big job for my first time. Its very strong as I put in some 7 layers of woven glass and a piece of 1/2" pressure treated lumber.

Here is a few other shots of the rigging removed and counter new tops

Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 Augusto-002-400x300


Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 Au-playingg-004-400x300

One more final coat of glass with filler to smooth things out and its time for a new coat of paint. What a learning experience.
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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptyThu Sep 06, 2012 5:27 pm

I think I may have the same problem. Did your fix solve it? Do you know how the water enters the false bilge and what the purpose of it is?
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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptyThu Sep 06, 2012 5:42 pm

Hey welcome to the site.

Short answer is no.

I have not seen the source of the water entrance yet. I did have the wife hold a bright flashlight on a dark night under the hull while I peeked around inside. That did not help.

I have a notion that the leak is slow and I can see an old keel crush repair on the nose of the keel trunk but that is my best guess.

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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptyThu Sep 06, 2012 6:23 pm

Looking good Floody!! Cool

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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptyThu Sep 06, 2012 6:50 pm

Thanks Everett.

Here is a photo of the keel trunk all repaired. Just waiting to paint.

Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 Pictures-Sep-1-014


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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptyFri Sep 07, 2012 7:28 pm

That's a nice job.

How bout coming to the Keys for a bit this winter? Our Seacraft has a leak somewhere round the keel trunk. When Gone goes in Seaweed comes out and to the yard.

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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptySun Sep 09, 2012 10:09 am

Thanks Everett, Once I get my circumnavigation started I will stop in the keys for a while. It appears very nice from what I have read.

Here is another update. I removed the pop top and drilled many holes in the glass and core. This allowed me to pour resin inside to stiffen up the top. It was suffering from a bit of delamination. As we walked on deck we could hear it crack feel it snap a bit. I figured time is now to repair this top while we are painting the inside of the boat.

First I removed as much paint as I could.
Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 Yard-sell-9-8-12-006-400x300

Then I drilled several holes, probably too many but no harm done.
Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 Yard-sell-9-8-12-007-400x300

Then I placed some weight to secure it while it cured.
Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 Yard-sell-9-8-12-010-400x300

I hope to finish the top today, storms are due in my area tomorrow so I am against the clock.

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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptySun Sep 09, 2012 1:47 pm

I corrected the spacing on your "My Website"



Feels good to be needed! lol



I am impressed at the high level of dedication you have put forth on the referb of your sailboat. Quite impressive!

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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptySun Sep 09, 2012 1:51 pm

Gary,

Thanks. I really want to just have a safe and fun time sailing, so I am trying to learn as much as I can on this cool boat we call Venus.

I am waiting for the top to dry as I type this. We had a squall come to town and I needed to wait for it to pass. lol

Soon ill put the top on and finish painting.

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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptySun Sep 09, 2012 4:14 pm

Congrats on the avatar, and congrats on 50 posts!

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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptySun Sep 16, 2012 9:41 pm

Can I can just wipe the are to be painted with some solvent as the last step? Or will it have to be a specific product?

Here is an update:

Looking into the cabin and the very dirty cockpit. We have had so many forest fires that everything is covered in this soot. Hell I can barely breath as I type this.

Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 Boat-pics-007-400x300

My new counter tops, although I still need to put the laminate on, looks great and they are stout. I used 3/4" oak plywood.

Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 Boat-pics-003-400x300

New settees with the same 3/4" ply cut and lacquered. Very strong now but I have to make the table fit better. Something changed while I had the old wood out.

Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 Boat-pics-001-400x300

And that nasty cup holdre issue is now covered awaiting paint.

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PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptySun Sep 16, 2012 11:10 pm

Looks like it is coming along great!

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retired1
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Posts : 83
Sailboat : 1974 CM21 Flush Deck
Male Birthday : 1947-06-30
Join date : 2012-07-22
Age : 72
Job/hobbies : Retired.. Rc Planes and Boats; Ham Radio

Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptySun Sep 16, 2012 11:48 pm

Floody, You get done there and the 21 will be a breeze. Come on out to Idaho and I'll watch the corn grow while you work on the boat. I won't forget you though. The fridge is full and the grill is lit.
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Everett CM32
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Everett CM32

Posts : 447
Sailboat : CM32 Aft Cockpit
Male Join date : 2011-12-28
Job/hobbies : Nuclear Nomad

Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptyMon Sep 17, 2012 6:09 am

Floody wrote:
Can I can just wipe the are to be painted with some solvent as the last step? Or will it have to be a specific product?

I have excellent luck w/ acetone.

Great to see your progress, looking good!! Cool

~~~~~ClipperMarine.Org~~~~~Clipper-Sailor.net~~~~~
1977 CM32 Sloop "J.F. Gone" Currently in re-fit, splashing 2013
1972 South Coast Seacraft 26 S/V "Seaweed" on the hook in Key Largo pirat
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Floody
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Posts : 154
Sailboat : Clipper Marine 26
Male Join date : 2012-05-24
Job/hobbies : Electronics Engineer

Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptyMon Sep 17, 2012 8:09 am

Ha thanks guys. I am so close to painting this old girl and want to try to get her in the water this weekend. But I have been saying this for months now.

I think today ill stop and get some acetone and wipe the walls and deck down real good with it before primer goes on.

I can see after this Ill have to work on "retired1's" boat. LOL cold beer motivates me well.

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http://www.theabrainfamily.com
Everett CM32
Lifetime Member
Lifetime Member
Everett CM32

Posts : 447
Sailboat : CM32 Aft Cockpit
Male Join date : 2011-12-28
Job/hobbies : Nuclear Nomad

Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 EmptyMon Sep 17, 2012 8:17 am

Don't forget the gloves when using acetone or any chemical....

~~~~~ClipperMarine.Org~~~~~Clipper-Sailor.net~~~~~
1977 CM32 Sloop "J.F. Gone" Currently in re-fit, splashing 2013
1972 South Coast Seacraft 26 S/V "Seaweed" on the hook in Key Largo pirat
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Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?    Keel meets the hull - damage. Repairable or new boat?  - Page 2 Empty

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